White Crane Boxing .... Internal?

Hello all,

I've been a member for a little while and although I don't post too often I am a fan of this forum and its approach to discussing the arts.

I'm a practitioner, researcher and seeker of the martial way which involves White Crane Boxing (in particular 鳴鶴拳Minghequan or Calling Crane with elements of Feeding Crane Fist 食鶴拳 and Shaking Crane Fist 宿鶴拳).

For me, my involvement has lead me to believe (and practice) that White Crane Boxing is essentially an Internal art even though it does not seem to be listed as such with regards to the big three (Taiji, Bagua, Hsing-I).

What are other fellow members thoughts on this? Is White Crane Boxing to be considered and internal art it is own right? Or is it simply a matter of one's own personal approach?

It is necessary to define what is "internal" and "external" kung fu.

shifu wrote:

Hello all,

I've been a member for a little while and although I don't post too often I am a fan of this forum and its approach to discussing the arts.

I'm a practitioner, researcher and seeker of the martial way which involves White Crane Boxing (in particular 鳴鶴拳Minghequan or Calling Crane with elements of Feeding Crane Fist 食鶴拳 and Shaking Crane Fist 宿鶴拳).

For me, my involvement has lead me to believe (and practice) that White Crane Boxing is essentially an Internal art even though it does not seem to be listed as such with regards to the big three (Taiji, Bagua, Hsing-I).

What are other fellow members thoughts on this? Is White Crane Boxing to be considered and internal art it is own right? Or is it simply a matter of one's own personal approach?

It is internal.

Over

E.T. wrote:

It is necessary to define what is "internal" and "external" kung fu.

This is one question hard to answer, depending on what family you are from.

My understanding is this: if your qi/yi or intention is ahead of your movement/strength, then this is internal martial art.

Usually yourself will feel the hands are light while others feel heavy.
I just start to feel this one recently. Need a lot of stance and zhangzhuan to consolidate it.

Over

intention is a good guideline of internal martial arts.

Overlord wrote:

E.T. wrote:

It is necessary to define what is "internal" and "external" kung fu.

This is one question hard to answer, depending on what family you are from.

My understanding is this: if your qi/yi or intention is ahead of your movement/strength, then this is internal martial art.

Usually yourself will feel the hands are light while others feel heavy.
I just start to feel this one recently. Need a lot of stance and zhangzhuan to consolidate it.

Over

Shaolin 10 animals or 5 animals, Fujian 5 ancestors, Tiger, Crane, all of them said their Yi (intention) is ahead of the movement. Are they internal kung fu?

Hi Sifu ET,

This is my understanding, different people got different approach.

If the intention and qi is a head of strength, then it is, regardless of the form.

of course, structure and muscle power are all important.

In combat, you dont care that much.

Let us take splashing hand for instance (regardless of style), is your intention ahead of your splashing hand during the process? Not really oh. So intention or yi ahead of the movement, very hard to do.

It is like open a door with key. No matter how fast, how strong you are, if your yi does not follow the key hole, the door remains locked. I like this analogy a lot. Zhangzhuan is the best way to teach yourself to familiar with this keyhole.

Over

Overlord wrote:

Hi Sifu ET,

This is my understanding, different people got different approach.

If the intention and qi is a head of strength, then it is, regardless of the form.

of course, structure and muscle power are all important.

In combat, you dont care that much.

Let us take splashing hand for instance (regardless of style), is your intention ahead of your splashing hand during the process? Not really oh. So intention or yi ahead of the movement, very hard to do.

It is like open a door with key. No matter how fast, how strong you are, if your yi does not follow the key hole, the door remains locked. I like this analogy a lot. Zhangzhuan is the best way to teach yourself to familiar with this keyhole.

Over

Hi brother Overload,

I mean because we don't have a common defination of "internal" and "external", we are almost impossible to discus on this topic.

For many years, I want to clearify this point. However, it seems people not really want to make this defination clear. Instead people only according to their own explainations for classifing what is internal and external.

What is internal and external kung fu is quite confusing and misleading discussion.

Hi Sifu ET,

Oh I see.
It is hard to define it.

During KMT era in China, when some official in Nanjing Central Guoshu Academy decide to separate martial art into internal and external, a lot of martial artist go against. Because it is ambiguous and because it separates the martial art community. Unfortunately, it was done. Sun Lutang being the head of Wudang and Gao something becomes the head of Shaolin.

Yi and Qi goes before movement is very secretive in lhbf. Years ago, you explain that to me I wont understand.

# 體合于心 # 心合于意 # 意合于氣 # 氣合于神 # 神合于動 # 動合于空

So the first three stages you practice with Zhangzhuan. Once your qi fills you up internally. Then the movement can start to promote more qi flow. Then gradually you find when your mind and qi goes ahead of your physical movement, it is lighter.

If your qi is not enough, you do say 15mins of santishi, you find there is more power when punching the bag.
Alot of people, including me will just continue to punching. I found that this is wrong. Zhangzhuan is like sharpen your sword, while punching bag practice is the testing the sharpness of the sword with rock. The Zhangzhuan and punching/strength training should be 100/1. But when you are young, it is best to do it 50/50.

This is just my personally understanding, could be wrong.

Last but not the least, happy new year Sifu ET.

Over

This guy is a fraud

Blitzmag wrote:

This guy is a fraud

Of course, it is just my humble experience, but i am honest about the thing i share, please share us your authentic method of training, regardless in your style or school. All welcome.


Sincerely yours,

Over